Ethan Smith is the CEO of Graphite—the leading SEO growth agency—and my go-to expert on SEO. After 18 years of mastering traditional SEO, Ethan has been at the forefront of what is called AEO: answer engine optimization, or, more simply, getting your product to show up in ChatGPT/Claude/Gemini/Perplexity answers. He’s discovered that ChatGPT traffic converts six times better than Google search—and most companies are completely missing this opportunity. In our conversation, we discuss: 1. His 7-step playbook to rank #1 in ChatGPT 2. Why ChatGPT traffic converts 6x better than Google 3. How early-stage startups can win at AEO immediately (unlike with SEO, which takes years) 4. The three tactics that actually work: landing pages, YouTube videos, and Reddit comments 5. Why help-center content can suddenly be your highest-ROI investment 6. The specific Reddit strategy that works (spoiler: be authentic) 7. Why AI-generated content doesn’t work — Brought to you by: Orkes—The enterprise platform for reliable applications and agentic workflows Vanta—Automate compliance. Simplify security. Great Question—Empower everyone to run great research — Where to find Ethan Smith: • Twitter: twitter.com/ethan_l_s • LinkedIn: bit.ly/ethans-linkedin • Graphite: graphite.io • Graphite Research Papers: bit.ly/graphite-five-percent — Where to find Lenny: • Newsletter: lennysnewsletter.com • X: twitter.com/lennysan • LinkedIn: — In this episode, we cover: — Resources and episode mentions: — Production and marketing by . For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com. — Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.